On February 18, 2010 RIA Novosti hosted a press conference “Prospects for the development of theological education in Russia”.
S.V. Chapnin:
Good afternoon, dear colleagues! We welcome you to the press conference on the introduction of state standard in Theology for higher education. Today, together with us, Prof. Heinz Ohme, Doctor of Theology, Head. cafe History of the ancient church of the theological faculty of the Humboldt University of Berlin, another guest from Germany prof. Notger Slenska, Doctor of Theology, lecturer in Fundamental Theology at the University of Berlin. Humboldt. Well-known to you is Archpriest Vladimir Vorobyov, rector of the largest church university in Russia, St. Tikhon Orthodox University for the Humanities, and what is especially important for us, co-chairman of the Educational and Methodological Association for Classical University Education in Theology of the Ministry of Education of the Russian Federation. Also among the speakers there are representatives of secular universities: Galina Borisovna Voronina, Dean of the Faculty German language MSLU, and Arsen Yakovlevich Kasyuk, Doctor of Historical Sciences, Professor, Director of the Institute international relations and socio-political sciences MSLU. And the representative of the Ministry of Education and Science Alexander Viktorovich Naumov - Director of the Department of State Science, Technology and Innovation Policy.
Let me make a small introduction. The conference that we are holding today, and the participation of German guests, is due to the fact that in the coming days the Annual International Conference will open at the Orthodox St. Tikhon Humanitarian University, in which university students, as well as German students of theology, mainly take part. This is a very important platform for joint communication between Russian and German theological students. There is only one rather serious problem. The fact is that German students have the opportunity to continue their academic education and academic work, the doors of graduate school are open for them, all the necessary attributes of a full-fledged academic career are available: the degree of doctor of theology, professorial title, guidance of students and graduate students. And for Russian students, these paths are closed. Having received a master's degree in their chosen specialty, they can continue their academic work as theologians only abroad, and in Russia they will have to defend their candidate and doctoral dissertations in related disciplines: philology, history, philosophy, and others. This is due to the fact that today the list of scientific specialties of the Higher Attestation Commission does not include the specialty Theology. On the other hand, the issue of the recognition of academic degrees awarded by Russian theological schools has not yet been resolved.
We look forward to major changes in the near future. As you know, the first progress arose after the meeting in 2009 between His Holiness Patriarch Kirill and Russian President Dmitry Medvedev. An instruction was given to develop an appropriate set of questions, and possibly Theology will be included in the list of HAC disciplines. In the meantime, it should be noted that theology in Russia at the level of higher education continues to develop actively: the number of universities that have passed licensing is growing - today it is approaching fifty. The Educational Standard Project for Third Generation Theology garnered a record 37 positive reviews. For half a year now, a working group of the Ministry of Education and Science of the Russian Federation on interaction with the Russian Orthodox Church and other traditional confessions has been operating, within which the passport of Theology is considered as a specialty of scientific workers. Our guests are directly related to this process.
At the beginning, I would ask Alexander Viktorovich Naumov to tell me what is happening in the Ministry. And then we will continue with your questions.
A.V. Naumov:
Thank you very much for the opportunity to shed light on this issue. I'll try not to take your attention too long. Indeed, this working group, where we are together with Father Vladimir, has already held four meetings, and a fifth meeting is planned. Moreover, we have transferred the issue related to the training of highly qualified personnel in the field of Theology into a practical plane.
I note that your words about the impossibility for students of theology to pursue an academic career as part of a degree are not entirely true. Since the Nomenclature of Scientific Specialties, which was approved in February 2009 by the Ministry of Education and Science after a two-year discussion with the scientific community, contains an adjacent area where specialists in theology could receive academic degrees as a candidate or doctor of science - this is Religious Studies and Philosophy of Religions . I certainly understand the significant issues associated with the field of Theology, so we work very closely in this group.
Firstly, we have already been able to resolve the issue of licensing and accreditation of spiritual educational institutions, the opening of councils for the defense of candidate and doctoral dissertations at theological schools. It's very close interaction leading university of Moscow State University with the Orthodox St. Tikhon University in terms of joint dissertation councils. Secondly, the issue of the inclusion of clergy with secular scientific degrees and academic titles in the composition of councils created at educational and scientific organizations has been resolved. Now we have one of the final moments in the framework of the specialty Theology - this is the next step for which we are now preparing. A special expert commission was created, headed by a respected scientist, corresponding member of the Russian Academy of Sciences, chairman of the Council of the Russian Humanitarian Scientific Foundation Yuri Leonidovich Vorotnikov. Members of the commission prepared a passport of the scientific specialty in Theology. By decision working group, in December 2009, the passport was sent for consideration to Rosobrnadzor, the federal executive body in charge of this direction, to the Higher Attestation Commission, in Russian academy Sciences and the Russian Union of Rectors. At the moment, we have already completed this procedure with the Higher Attestation Commission and are completing it with the Russian Union of Rectors and the Russian Academy of Sciences. Based on the results of the consideration, we will make a final decision within our working group and prepare recommendations, including to the Minister of Education and Science on this issue. Thank you.
Archpriest Vladimir Vorobyov:
This problem has a long history. For several years we have been working on the issue of introducing the specialty Theology to the list of scientific specialties of the Higher Attestation Commission. And I must say that most of the scientists and academicians, representatives of other universities support and have a positive attitude towards this process. The situation was complicated by the speech of 10 academicians headed by the late Academician Ginsburg, where it was said that theology is not a science, and one should not confuse science, which operates with facts and logical proofs, with theology, which is allegedly based only on faith. This letter was widely circulated in the media, and it must be said that all those who do not want to speed up the process are very fond of referring to it. But in recent times, especially after the meeting of our President with His Holiness Patriarch Kirill, the situation changed in positive side. The Ministry of Education is meeting us halfway, the commission, which Alexander Viktorovich spoke about, really works in a very benevolent style, and I think that all these misunderstandings should be resolved soon.
But of course here great importance has a social recession, the way our society perceives this problem. Based on the feedback we've collected over the course of recent years, one might think that our people wish that Orthodox education, Orthodox science and other religious science, the theological science of Islam - all of them were restored in their rights. Those. in the rights that they had before the revolution in Russia and have in almost all countries.
Impossible to come to European country, or America, or Asia, and declare that theology is not a science. I think it will sound funny. And this will be confirmed by our dear guests from Germany. Because theology is the first science with which European universities began. And the Doctor of Theology has always been an honorary degree. So, of course, such statements should be forgotten - these are remnants of the Soviet period. I think that soon we will overcome these problems and begin to defend works in theology, doctoral, candidate. This will contribute to the development of theology in our universities, to the emergence of more theological departments. Our people will begin to turn to their Orthodox culture, Muslims to their Islamic culture, they will acquire faith, moral foundations, and our life will change for the better.
S.V. Chapnin:
Thank you Father Vladimir. Dear colleagues, do you have any questions.
1. Tell us more about the passport of the scientific specialty Theology, what kind of document is it?
A.V. Naumov:
The fact is that for each scientific specialty there should be a passport, which defines the main directions of this specialty, the main requirements that apply to this specialty.
Theology, at least within the framework of our working group, is considered a scientific specialty, should on a general basis answer general requirements, so that the academic degrees that will be awarded in the event of the introduction of this scientific specialty meet the general requirements that apply to other specialties. For these purposes, we are working on this passport so that it fully complies with the regulatory framework that regulates the issue of awarding academic degrees in Russian Federation.
2. Is it known what next step the state will take in order to recognize theology as a science? (Russian newspaper)
A.V. Naumov:
This step is defined regulatory framework Government and the Ministry to which the right of this regulation is granted. Accordingly, the necessary changes will be made to the Regulations on the training of scientific, pedagogical and scientific personnel and to the List of scientific specialties. It is also approved by the Ministry of Education and Science, registered with the Ministry of Justice and is a common normative act for all.
Further, on the basis of the VAK, a expert advice in theology, and it will be possible to supply dissertations defended in the dissertation council, for example, of our university or other higher educational institutions.
3. Vladimir Nikolsky. Magazine " Higher education in Russia"
Last year, a higher church postgraduate school was established. Restrictions - only citizens of the Orthodox faith are protected in it. If we say that theology stands on common ground with other sciences, isn't there a contradiction here?
A.V. Naumov:
One point I would like to dwell on, unfortunately, I did not immediately cover it in my speech. We are interacting with the main confessions in the Russian Federation. Although there are only representatives Orthodox Church, but our working group also includes representatives of Islam, Judaism and Buddhism.
Moreover, all confessions communicate very closely with each other within the framework of the issue of introducing theology as a scientific specialty. Moreover, we have no contradictions here, and everything related to the multi-confessional approach, of course, will be reflected in the solution of this issue.
4. Still, in my opinion, doubts remain in the scientific community about the scientific nature of theology. I do not refer to the "letter of ten", but rather to my personal communication with university professors.
What actions are you going to take to work with ordinary scientists, teachers, to convince them that theology is real scientific knowledge.
Archpriest Vladimir Vorobyov:
Of course, such an opinion cannot disappear immediately, because our time was preceded by a long period of atheistic education and atheistic science. It is impossible to immediately eradicate these approaches from the minds of people - it takes time. And we understand this very well. We are engaged in the most tolerant and peaceful dialogue with all who wish to discuss this matter. We hold various conferences, communicate with many universities, hold round tables, and appear in the press. We have interaction within the framework of the UMO of classical universities, there is an association of non-state universities, of which we are members, and so on.
So wherever possible, we are happy to answer questions that we are asked.
G.B. Voronina:
I am very grateful for the invitation to this conference. I represent the Moscow State Linguistic University, which implements 26 specialties. Since 2003, thanks to the efforts of our rector, Irina Ivanovna Khaleeva, who, due to objective circumstances, could not attend, a new specialty "Theology" was opened. We already have two releases. The difference between our small theological department is that it is located at the Faculty of the German Language, where Germanists and linguists are trained - this is a piece production. The first graduation took place two years ago, there were 20 students in total, half of them graduated with honors. This year 25 people graduated, and ten of them received the so-called "red diploma". And what is significant is that we brilliantly passed accreditation two years ago, and you yourself can probably guess that those students, those applicants who choose this specialty, should not have a void here - I point to my heart. These are, of course, other students: in their intellect, in their moral qualities, they are ahead of other students. Education at our university differs from similar universities in that our students study six languages: three ancient languages are Church Slavonic, Latin, Ancient Greek, and three modern languages- German, English and modern Russian.
That is, these people are unique in their education. It is no coincidence that most of them, working on graduation projects, connect their future path with science and find themselves in a dead end. Of course, we talk to them and inform them that they have the opportunity - both Father Vladimir and Alexander Viktorovich spoke about this today - to go to a related specialty, be it philosophy, religious studies, the same philology. But for graduates who have graduated from the theology department, this becomes a betrayal of their interests. Of course, we attach them to related specialties, but this is not at all what they expected when they received this unique specialty. Therefore, now I speak on behalf of my students, from the department of theology: everything possible must be done so that the public supports us, so that theology becomes a VAK specialty. This is a monstrous injustice, it is not by chance that I use the word "monstrous". A monstrous injustice when the traditions of our country were broken and destroyed in 1917.
Indeed, you spoke correctly, father Vladimir, when the University of Bologna was created - the first university in Europe - the first faculty was the Faculty of Theology. The same thing happened in Germany, Professor Ohme can tell us about it now. And in Europe it goes without saying that theology is just as much a scientific discipline as any other. We cannot be enemies, we cannot be antagonists. For example, I perceive this as an injustice. If representatives of the evolutionist direction believe that only they have the right to the ultimate truth, then they deprive the representatives of the other direction of their truth. I am very glad that among those present there are my graduates. For example, Alena Vorobyova. She now works at St. Tikhon's University. We offered her to stay with us, but she wanted to connect her fate with Orthodoxy and teach with specialists.
And now I am grateful for the invitation. Thank you.
S.V. Chapnin:
Thank you. I would like to give the floor to Arsen Yakovlevich Kasyuk. Since we have already said that the upcoming standard is multi-confessional, it is necessary to talk about the teaching of Islam.
AND I. Kasyuk:
I would like to dwell on a few issues. The question naturally arises about state universities for the training of theologians. It seems to me that this is a big state task. Yes, according to our constitution, the Church and the state are separated, but the state is far from being indifferent to the spirit in which the people who will become the shepherds of the souls of our society will be prepared.
There was not a single Islamic educational institution in the Soviet Union. After the collapse of the Union, it was thought that the training of clerics for Muslims would continue. Such personnel began to be trained in Pakistan, Jordan, Saudi Arabia. Most schools - I would not like to generalize, there are well-known educational institutions there, for example, Al-Azhar in Egypt, it is already 1200 years old - they train people who are absolutely not in the spirit of supporting our country, our fatherland. You know the various currents of Wahhabism, Turanism, and so on. Therefore, five years ago, the President of the Russian Federation issued a decree on the need for support and assistance religious education and especially Islamic. The state of Islamic education at that time was deplorable. Today we have 25 universities, and seven of them are part of a single association of universities, where students are trained with an in-depth study of the culture of Islam. Such applicants are sent to us by the councils of muftis of Russia. This year we will have our first edition. These are secular specialists who will work in this direction. This is the first thing I wanted to draw attention to.
And the second question. We have developed a division between theology and theology. This, in my opinion, to a certain extent verbiage. Theology is a tracing paper from the ancient Greek "theology". And in the old, pre-revolutionary times, they called theology theological education in the West, that is, Catholic and Protestant, while the Orthodox was called theology. Although in essence it is the same thing. And that huge gap, which exists today, was not. It has developed historically during the years of Soviet power.
Many professors of the Moscow Theological Academy - Klyuchevsky, Lebedev, you can name many names - taught at the same time at Moscow State University. The picture was about the same in Kazan. Many graduates of theological academies became secular teachers. It seems to me that the relationship could develop in this direction, not only because religion or the Church was to a certain extent state in tsarist Russia, but because the educational level in both the Theological Academies and secular educational institutions was approximately the same. It seems to me that this is what we should strive for now. Moscow State Linguistic University is making great efforts to this end. By the decision of the heads of governments of the CIS, MSLU University was assigned the title of a basic organization for the study of languages and cultures of the CIS countries. We have been working together for about four years and have created a Council for spiritual education representatives of various universities of the CIS. We hope to continue working in this direction. Thank you.
S.V. Chapnin: Thanks Arsen Yakovlevich!
5. Olga Lipich (RIA Novosti):
I have a clarifying question. What steps will be taken after the passport is approved by all four authorities you mentioned? Amendments will be made, the list will change and a dissertation council will be created in the VAK or something else?
And the second question. Could our German guests tell us in more detail about the goals of the conference, the issues to be discussed, and its guests.
Naumov Alexander Viktorovich:
I have a very short answer. We still plan to first consider this passport with the conclusions of the organizations that I spoke about at a meeting of our working group, submit it to the minister for decision, in order to make a final decision.
Archpriest Vladimir Vorobyov:
Student conferences between Humboldt University and our St. Tikhon University have been taking place for several years now. Once every two years we meet in Moscow or Berlin, in turn. It must be said that students do very good work and give excellent presentations. Students go on internships to each other. And this cooperation, I think, is of great importance not only for educational and scientific process but also to improve mutual understanding between our peoples. We are very grateful to Humboldt University for its willingness to cooperate with us. This year, in the spring, we will host the rector of Humboldt University. We hope that a broad agreement on cooperation between our universities will be signed. Thank you.
G.B. Voronina:
Let me also say a few words. MSLU has extensive contacts with the University. Humboldt for over 30 years. As you might guess, only linguistic students participated in this work before. Theology students have been participating for three years now.
And Mr. Rector, Professor Markshis, has already been to our university as part of our cooperation. That is, we already have such experience. For six years we have been hosting an international student forum. It is attended by students from several Moscow universities and students from Humboldt University. For discussion, we choose mainly theological topics. In June of this year, we will organize a similar forum with the Orthodox St. Tikhon humanitarian university. The theme of our future forum is "Leo Tolstoy and his Christianity", although the global theme is "Globalization and Identity". Thank you.
S.V. Chapnin:
It would probably be wrong, when discussing the topics of cooperation, not to give the floor to our guests. The question could be clarified as follows. How does the Humboldt University see the prospects for cooperation, student exchange, scientific cooperation with Russian theological universities?
Prof. Heinz Ohme:
This year Humboldt University of Berlin is celebrating its 200th anniversary. Since its inception, this university has always been the founder of educational reforms throughout the country. The very sample, the standard, which was developed at the university in the 19th century, has now developed and acquired a scale, one might say, of a world level. That is, starting from 1810, from the day the university was founded, the scientific program was developed and further developed by the outstanding theologian of the 19th century, Friedrich Schleiermacher. Thus, theology was integrated into the entire scientific complex of disciplines taught at Humboldt University. Of course, you know that from the very beginning of the existence of European universities, it was theology that gave them a powerful impetus for development. In this sense, nothing has changed. This was not changed after the 1918 revolution in Germany. Nothing has changed since the end of World War II. In the then formed GDR, on the territory of which there were six universities, the faculties of theology functioned as before.
I would like to name some figures. There are 19 evangelical theological faculties in Germany and 12 Roman Catholic ones. In addition, there are many more institutes, about fifty. In total, we can say that today we have about 52 thousand students studying both evangelical and Catholic theology. The difference between these educational institutions consists in the fact that only faculties have the right to defend dissertations, both candidate and doctoral. That is, the faculties public universities, with professors recruited by the state. Their diplomas and dissertations are also recognized by the state. Every year, I emphasize, every year 200 PhD theses and 50 dissertations that correspond to doctoral ones. All this suggests that the very formulation of the question of the unscientific nature of theology is absurd for us.
Prof. Notger Slenska:
I would like to add just a few words to what has been said. It must be said that the theological faculty participates on an equal footing in the dialogue with other faculties. We are developing in common scientific programs, historical scientific disciplines. We work together with philologists and historians. For example, dogmatic theology, ethical theology. It is my task to represent precisely these aspects of activity in the general worldview picture. I work closely with the Faculty of Philosophy and the Faculty of Natural Sciences. Of course, in these dialogues we each represent our own position, but this is always a dialogue on an equal footing.
And now, perhaps, more about why we have theological faculties - a phenomenon taken for granted. First of all, it must be said that the state itself shows interest in the development of theology as a science. The state should be interested in the fact that people who profess a certain faith enter into a dialogue and show their attitude towards it. And among others, this interest is manifested in the fact that the state itself encourages the opening of similar Islamic faculties, as well as Jewish ones.
6. " graduate School education".
Question for the German guests. In Russia there is a Higher Attestation Commission. She makes a decision, at the opening of the dissertation council, awards scientific degrees. Is there an analogue in Germany of such a commission at the state level, or is this question given to faculties that create Councils at their own discretion and award academic degrees?
Prof. Heinz Ohme:
The issue of state recognition of diplomas and scientific degrees itself is not new. The faculties are too differentiated for this. And it doesn't matter what specialty we are talking about. It is fundamentally about whether a particular faculty has the right to accept dissertations for defense.
And most the highest degree is the defense of theological dissertations. We, theologians, laugh, for example, about candidate and doctoral works in medicine. For us, this is a scientific level that cannot be compared.
Your question was about the state. The state is asked when we are talking about the creation of a new theological faculty. Thus, after World War II, eight new theological faculties were established in Germany. Then there was the question of who has the right to teach there. And here the decision was taken by the state. This is a guarantee that a certain scientific level will be maintained.
Active state organization called the Scientific Council. This organization advises the federal government on the subject of academic degrees at the presidential level. Just recently, a month ago, a new statement from the Theological Council was issued and published. But in this publication, the question of the scientific nature of theology is not even raised. The recommendations of the Council concern that, along with evangelical and Catholic theology, education should also be carried out in the Judaic and Islamic religions.
This testifies to the interest not of some religious group, but, on the contrary, of the high state interest in religion. The state is obliged to respond to such requests from the population for training. This is the duty of the state. Therefore, the thesis about the withering away of theological science has long been outdated. We all share a common responsibility.
7. Yulia Zaitseva. Blagovest-info.
When is the minister's decision expected? As I understand it, you have no doubt that it will be positive. What will be the next steps?
A.V. Naumov:
In March the decision of our working group will be ready. This issue is under the control of the Presidential Administration. Accordingly, we will make a report to the Presidential Administration. Further, technical work will begin on amending the Nomenclature of Scientific Specialties and other approvals. I mean the registration of this order in the Ministry of Justice. April is real time decision making.
Blagovest-info: That is, the Orthodox are waiting for a gift for Easter?
A.V. Naumov: Maybe yes.
Born in 1960 in the city of Nalchik, KBR.Graduated in 1996 from the College of Design in Nalchik.
Member of the Union of Artists of Russia since 1998. Participant of republican, zonal, Russian and foreign exhibitions.
Died in 2008.
Arsen Ambaryan is an original artist who is passionately engaged in various types of art. For many years, since 1981, he has been working in children's national journals Nur, Nur. The illustrations for these magazines, made by the artist, are imbued with the charm and warmth of a person who is infinitely in love with life, nature, and animals. Working as an artist in the puppet theater, he realized his love for the natural world in the scenery and costumes of fairy-tale characters. In ceramics and jewelry, a wonderful sense of the material and its plastic variants are acutely felt. But he works most steadily in the creation of small plastic arts - he sculpts animals in clay, then translating them into wood, metal, stone. He strives to convey in each created work the unique character of the animal. Ambaryan's works are exhibited at numerous exhibitions of the republican and Russian level. They fill the workshop's shelving. They contain not only knowledge of the plasticity of the animal, but the warmth and great love of the artist for the World, adorned with these marvelous creatures. Collaborated with galleries and salons of the most prestigious level.
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